Author Topic: New player questions: Jobs, Character Devolopment, Optimal Outcome  (Read 5319 times)

Scythyn

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Hi everyone,
Just to clarify, i'm not a begginner asking what a charm is or where to do this and get that,
no i'm capable of reading the wiki.

What i'm having trouble locating is an "optimal" guide. Basically a level by level progression of some sorts,
or not even that, just some advice on jobs and character development. Are jobs worth it? i've read mention
of people only training skills until late game, and then using jobs to gain the necessary evolution skills, and
'tweek' their attributes, is that viable? How do the pro PvP'ers get their characters to that level of perfection?

My question to experienced players is, What do i need to do to have the best possible character i can have,
in the way of skills and jobs. I know i need max basically every skill i can, but i'm not sure about the max char
growth etc.  Also i know its alot to ask but in the way of the harder skills (cheat death etc.) when is the best
time/place to train? My fear is creating a sub-par character and having to live with mediocrity.

Thanks in Advance, any help is sppreciated, i know this forum has a reputation of being really helpful, and welcoming,
i hope thats true, I know this kind of information will help other power-gamers too,


Cheers
-Scythyn

Arimith

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About the forum is usually true as long as Zenetar doesn't get there first :)

The main thing to worry about if you want to twink your character out is spirit and HP skills.  In almost every case, it is best to get all of these skills as early as possible, it's a general rule that the higher level you are, the harder it is to direct what skill you level up (particularly for things like Cheat Death).  There are lists of skills that give HP and spirit bonuses on the wiki - someone more helpful than I may post them or you can look them up :)

Next is your combat skills, charms and stats.
In general, you want *all* your combat skills as high as possible, as often some of the best charms will have a secondary rune/requirement on it that isn't necessarily in line with your 'normal' combat style.
Most of the best charms can be gained from dungeons, which also has the benefit of being 'free' - do dungeons as often as you can. Keep an eye out for the good crafts too, though I don't really remember many great ones at low levels - some of them require you to run halfway around the world and back for ingredients so it's good to have a way of keeping track of what you need and where to get it/use it.
Depending on the type of character you're aiming for, a generally good rule of thumb for stat distribution is 4:4:3:2 - this allows you to use a variety of different styles, which will help you beat dungeons earlier than you might otherwise be able to. - That's another point, if you want to excel with, for example, axes, that doesn't mean you should do that to the exclusion of all else.  A well-rounded character will save you a lot of farming for PvE fights and generally make them a lot easier.

Also, join a guild - it's a nice place where you can ask a question and get a decent response fairly quickly, and people will also generally be more forthcoming when it comes to spoilers for the quests :)



EDIT: Oh, as to jobs - I advocate a balanced approach to this, very early (levels 1-10) I'd say work daily for as many points as you can, 11-30 work mostly (but not all) travel jobs, as you say, using work for tweaking your stats to the way you want them - try to also use the jobs that gives skills wherever possible too, it takes a long time to get them all!
If you're looking for perfection at every stage, minimal stats from jobs is best, but that will take a very long time and get quite boring, so I don't recommend it.
« Last Edit: 02:48:34 - 09/15/11 by Arimith »
Loose is what your underwear is when the elastic breaks
Lose is what then happens to your dignity

Toben

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The best PvPing character possible for any level, N, will have: 1.) all of the available skills which grant extra hit points or spirit mastered; 2.) within those constraints, stats perfectly distributed to be able to use charms of their primary rune that have a level requirement of N and a handful of other runes that are level N or N-1, N-2, and probably a hefty dump stat which completely prevents them from using other charms.

For a made up example (and I'm not going to check the math to make sure this is actually possible), your level 17 future fighter->wizard->pyro, to excel at PvP, would have 78 Pow and 59 Int to be able to use Warrior's Fire Staff, and actually would probably want to have 85 Pow and 52 Dex to run Warrior's Shadow Staff. This wouldn't leave you many stat points left over for Con, so your Con would probably be awfully low. And you would probably need to work some carefully selected jobs in order to get your stats distributed just *so*.

Finally, you'd want a charm collection which has 5 copies of all the charms you might actually want to use, so check the wiki, look for charms to improve your gear, and track them down and farm or craft them. That's how you wind up with the ultimate level 17 twink, who will excel at PvP at that level; maintain that each level, and you should continue to excel at PvP well into the mid-40s.

Note that: well into the mid-40s, but *not* the endgame. By the endgame, that strongly dumped Int, and all those jobs you worked to keep your stats distributed just *so*, will start to catch up to you. You can certainly make an excellent endgame character out of a twinked-out lower-level PVPer, but it's a lot more of a slow grind - you will need to raise your dump stat a large amount, and you won't have much available job growth with which to do so, so you're looking at a long period of drinking elixirs once a day to raise your dump stat, while a lot of those points you put into your main stats from doing jobs will be wasted when your main stats end up way, way higher than the very highest requirements for any charm use. An easier endgame-oriented character growth switches the priorities around - your first priority is to master every single skill you can; your second priority is to farm as many charms as possible; and your third priority is to have your stats adjusted to at least be able to select the correct classes, but using charms at the very first level they open up is a far lower priority and your stats overall are probably much more balanced. In that case, you will virtually never work a job for the stat points it gives you, using all or almost all your jobs to move using Conveyer or Messenger so you can farm more dungeons; any other jobs you work will probably be focused on getting you job skills you need, like Remorseless or Discipline or whatever. At later levels you can use your 900 points of available growth to get your lower stats up so you can use, say, all the level 50 epics as soon as possible.

Most folks opt for sort of a middle path between endgame optimization and being awesome at PvP right then; spend most of your jobs on movements, but occasionally use one here or there to help tweak your stats to let you use better charms; master all the skills, but concentrate on the +HP and +spirit skills first; have a dump stat but don't let it get too, too far behind your other stats; that kind of thing. You'll be an above-average PvPer, if not completely, utterly twinked out, and you'll still be in a good position to master everything when you make it to the endgame.

Finally though, you're never *stuck* with mediocrity in this game - I've seen some really terrible, abandoned characters get given away to other players who were able to turn them around, get them farmed up, and make decent characters out of them. It's impossible to get stuck with an unfixably mediocre character -- fixing them up just takes more time than not making them that way in the first place. So don't stress too much; the game's no fun if you're worrying that every click might ruin your toon, and trust me: it won't.

As for skills, Cheat death, etc., there's loads of threads in this forum about it and the best times/places for training it and other skills like Leadership, etc.; the Old Goblin and the Pet Rock in the Arena are both quite popular training dummies for a lot of skills. As a rule of thumb I would say, try to start working on skills as early as you can - the game goes from less complex to more complex as you level up, so the earlier you can train a skill, the fewer different variables you'll have to worry about.

« Last Edit: 03:53:54 - 10/10/11 by Toben »

Scythyn

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Thank you both so much, thats the kind of information i was after, so thank you.

I should have mentioned i'll be playing a pyromancer, or champion, not sure, as both appealt to me. I will be going for a pretty average build,
"middle-path" like you said, i just wanted to know how *not* to stuff up ur character :)

Also on a side note, i know zenetar, his alt (assassin from cheese dip) helped me last year haha, this is my second char but my first
sucked sooooo bad :(

So this one will be better. on another side note, either of you two have a guild opening/ and/or a place for an apprentice?

Thanks again :)

Arimith

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Just sent you an invite to TEC, you can set me as your mentor if you like, though I'm sure someone else would appreciate the mentoring points (I've already maxed mine)
Loose is what your underwear is when the elastic breaks
Lose is what then happens to your dignity

Arimith

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Finally though, you're never *stuck* with mediocrity in this game - I've seen some really terrible, abandoned characters get given away to other players who were able to turn them around, get them farmed up, and make decent characters out of them. It's impossible to get stuck with an unfixably mediocre character -- fixing them up just takes more time than not making them that way in the first place. So don't stress too much; the game's no fun if you're worrying that every click might ruin your toon, and trust me: it won't.

QFT
Loose is what your underwear is when the elastic breaks
Lose is what then happens to your dignity

Blacksol

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Also when farming dungeons and soul gems (from PvPing) try and use runes other than your main runes.

When farming the arena mobs for skills also try and use your runes from your lowest  farmed skills as filler, and you can generally farm multiple skills at once in the arena (or against poor PvPers especially if attacking 2 levels above as then only 8ap a fight) so can get over 10 skill points per fight

Cecilo

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I am a beginner here, and other than game I would like to know how to create new threads?
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